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Return of the 442?
Topic Started: Aug 22 2013, 04:43 AM (7,430 Views)
ZeeZoo
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AntMcfc
Aug 22 2013, 03:21 PM
4222 is a variation of 442 lol. If you asked a layman on the street to watch City vs Newcastle, they'd tell you we played 442. if you asked a proper analyst (me, dag etc) to look and analyse further, taking into account who the manager is, who the players were and how our players actually played, you'd assimilate that it was nearer a 4222 than anything.

There are only slight differences between the two formations; the central midfielders perform different roles, we didn't play with a fixed double pivot, Yaya controlled and created from deep while offering protection for the back four, while Fernandinho was allowed to roam more. The two were flexible of course but this was the general pattern of play. The wide players were used as genuine interiores, even Navas, the archetypal touchline hugger, came into central areas regularly. And lastly, despite using a 2 upfront, of course Aguero and Dzeko didn't remain in fixed, adjacent, forward positions all game, one of the two was always coming deep to collect the ball, as well as running into channels and opening up space in the central areas for the interiores to move into. Aguero has commonly been the man to drop deep but there were plenty of occasions where Dzeko was in a deeper position, acting as a focal point, while Aguero was running in behind him and again, into the channels.

So yes, slight variation, but undoubtedly a 442 on the surface, and a 4222 when analysed further.
Look here ffs, the twat creates a thread about tactics on a football forum so do I post back as a simpleton or post back with a quality grasp of tactics.

If you say that 442 and 4222 are the same formation then fuck off to the pub and have a discussion there.
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ZeeZoo
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AntMcfc
Aug 22 2013, 03:39 PM
ZeeZoo
Aug 22 2013, 03:37 PM
AntMcfc
Aug 22 2013, 03:36 PM
ZZ has been on Wikipedia and seen Hargreaves deployed on the right on one of their lineups.
That's not even possible.
No?

Posted Image
Well I blatantly wasn't aware of that so whilst you've provided the evidence for it existing, you've also provided the evidence for me not knowing it existed.

Score draw, scrappy match where the minnows scored a lucky goal and an own goal.
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AntMcfc
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It's not the same formation, it's a variant.
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ZeeZoo
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AntMcfc
Aug 22 2013, 03:40 PM
It's not the same formation, it's a variant.
If it's a variant what the fuck is the point of this thread? Then by that 4222 and 4411 are variants and then by Mert's definition the 442 "and its variants" has never gone out of date thus rendering this thread void right from the off.
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Scholes
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Hurry up and post Cule, got things to do.
Scholes
 

Seriously, Frank Lampard is an absolute legend of the game. He needs to be recognised in some way eg. Frank Lampard OBE, Sir Frank Lampard or some kind of lifetime achievement award.

AntMcfc
 
Greatest ownage machine: Scholes. Absolute animal when he was a regular poster, I always knew I was in the right when he was backing me up, and I couldn't wait to read a topic that he was posting in because I knew he'd be tearing someone apart
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elcule
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AntMcfc
Aug 22 2013, 03:21 PM
4222 is a variation of 442 lol. If you asked a layman on the street to watch City vs Newcastle, they'd tell you we played 442. if you asked a proper analyst (me, dag etc) to look and analyse further, taking into account who the manager is, who the players were and how our players actually played, you'd assimilate that it was nearer a 4222 than anything.

There are only slight differences between the two formations; the central midfielders perform different roles, we didn't play with a fixed double pivot, Yaya controlled and created from deep while offering protection for the back four, while Fernandinho was allowed to roam more. The two were flexible of course but this was the general pattern of play. The wide players were used as genuine interiores, even Navas, the archetypal touchline hugger, came into central areas regularly. And lastly, despite using a 2 upfront, of course Aguero and Dzeko didn't remain in fixed, adjacent, forward positions all game, one of the two was always coming deep to collect the ball, as well as running into channels and opening up space in the central areas for the interiores to move into. Aguero has commonly been the man to drop deep but there were plenty of occasions where Dzeko was in a deeper position, acting as a focal point, while Aguero was running in behind him and again, into the channels.

So yes, slight variation, but undoubtedly a 442 on the surface, and a 4222 when analysed further.
:cheers: :cheers:

Top stuff. I would like to see more teams playing with two strikers, makes for much more exciting football matches. Atletí made it work pretty well last night against Barcelona as well.
Posted Image

Winner.

"If I go to Anfield and someone puts the ball into the box and Carragher hammers it out of play the fans applaud. At Camp Nou you would never be applauded for that." - Xavi
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ZeeZoo
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Scholes
Aug 22 2013, 03:44 PM
Hurry up and post Cule, got things to do.
Spent a couple of minutes posting a one line post?

Autism.
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elcule
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Scholes
Aug 22 2013, 03:44 PM
Hurry up and post Cule, got things to do.
Sorry mate, I was just looking at some of the Barca highlights :lol: I would have made more of an effort if I knew you were waiting.
Posted Image

Winner.

"If I go to Anfield and someone puts the ball into the box and Carragher hammers it out of play the fans applaud. At Camp Nou you would never be applauded for that." - Xavi
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ZeeZoo
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I'm struggling here, I really am. One thinks United play Nani & co. as wide men in a 442, says 4222/4411 are variants but then the formations haven't died so what is the purpose of the opening post if he makes the conclusion that they're variants that United have been playing 4411, then you try to differentiate between the formations because, after all, this is a football forum and if you didn't attempt to differentiate, as I mentioned before, the thread is void right from OP. Then one twat wades in not realising Hargreaves played a RM and then a fucking autistic twat jumps out of the bush with a shit ass post.

Got some real spastics on show here.
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Scholes
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elcule
Aug 22 2013, 03:47 PM
Scholes
Aug 22 2013, 03:44 PM
Hurry up and post Cule, got things to do.
Sorry mate, I was just looking at some of the Barca highlights :lol: I would have made more of an effort if I knew you were waiting.
Verdict on the a la argument please. ZZ needs putting in his place, it doesn't mean 'for example'.
Scholes
 

Seriously, Frank Lampard is an absolute legend of the game. He needs to be recognised in some way eg. Frank Lampard OBE, Sir Frank Lampard or some kind of lifetime achievement award.

AntMcfc
 
Greatest ownage machine: Scholes. Absolute animal when he was a regular poster, I always knew I was in the right when he was backing me up, and I couldn't wait to read a topic that he was posting in because I knew he'd be tearing someone apart
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ZeeZoo
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Scholes
Aug 22 2013, 03:48 PM
elcule
Aug 22 2013, 03:47 PM
Scholes
Aug 22 2013, 03:44 PM
Hurry up and post Cule, got things to do.
Sorry mate, I was just looking at some of the Barca highlights :lol: I would have made more of an effort if I knew you were waiting.
Verdict on the a la argument please. ZZ needs putting in his place, it doesn't mean 'for example'.
No, because that would be "par exemple"
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ZeeZoo
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elcule
Aug 22 2013, 03:47 PM
Scholes
Aug 22 2013, 03:44 PM
Hurry up and post Cule, got things to do.
Sorry mate, I was just looking at some of the Barca highlights :lol: I would have made more of an effort if I knew you were waiting.
Could you change your display pic to:-



Posted Image




So I can dismiss your posts without having to read them.

Thanks.
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elcule
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Scholes
Aug 22 2013, 03:48 PM
elcule
Aug 22 2013, 03:47 PM
Scholes
Aug 22 2013, 03:44 PM
Hurry up and post Cule, got things to do.
Sorry mate, I was just looking at some of the Barca highlights :lol: I would have made more of an effort if I knew you were waiting.
Verdict on the a la argument please. ZZ needs putting in his place, it doesn't mean 'for example'.
Dictionary definition means "in the style/manner of". You probably could say a 442 à la United in '99, but that's only if you accept there's more than one version of a 442, which he didn't, so really it just becomes a tautology.
Posted Image

Winner.

"If I go to Anfield and someone puts the ball into the box and Carragher hammers it out of play the fans applaud. At Camp Nou you would never be applauded for that." - Xavi
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AntMcfc
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ZeeZoo
Aug 22 2013, 03:43 PM
AntMcfc
Aug 22 2013, 03:40 PM
It's not the same formation, it's a variant.
If it's a variant what the fuck is the point of this thread? Then by that 4222 and 4411 are variants and then by Mert's definition the 442 "and its variants" has never gone out of date thus rendering this thread void right from the off.
To discuss whether there's early signs of a shift in emphasis from 4231 (one striker system) to 442 (two striker system). He wasn't even making the statement, just trying to provoke debate, which inadvertently he has done.
Edited by AntMcfc, Aug 22 2013, 03:55 PM.
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ZeeZoo
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elcule
Aug 22 2013, 03:52 PM
Scholes
Aug 22 2013, 03:48 PM
elcule
Aug 22 2013, 03:47 PM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
Verdict on the a la argument please. ZZ needs putting in his place, it doesn't mean 'for example'.
Dictionary definition means "in the style/manner of". You probably could say a 442 à la United in '99, but that's only if you accept there's more than one version of a 442, which he didn't, so really it just becomes a tautology.
That's presuming I'm using "a la" in a French language context as opposed to an English language context. A la is a French phrase used by English speakers, the case in point here, in which it translates to "like" (English usage) as opposed to "in the style of" (French language).

Well and truly twatted.
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