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Miguel Veloso
Topic Started: Jan 27 2009, 11:47 AM (817 Views)
DaGunners
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Danny Dyer
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7seven7
Jan 27 2009, 03:12 PM
PaulPinpointScholes
Jan 27 2009, 06:47 PM
Quote:
 
He is a little improvement on what we have, although Flamini is better.

Now Veloso, he would be fantastic and is an IMPROVEMENT of Flamini.


O'dear DaG :hysterics: :hysterics: :hysterics:

The problem is that what you say is not a change in opinion, it is a complete contradiction that negates the value of whatever you might say. This is because if 4 months ago you thought that Veloso was an improvement on Flamini and fantastic then how can you possibly say that he's gone backwards in the last 2 years? Basically, whatever you say must therefore be taken on a day to day basis, and football doesn't happen on a day to day basis, it happens over weeks, months and years.

Also, yes, you have no DM's, but you ignore my point about Viera, Petit Gilberto, and Flamini. Namely that Wenger has only had good teams when a DM is present.

None of those players were DMs. And Denilson is a player capable of playing independent of the machine/cog idea...
I am soft.
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ManYou
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Thierry Henry
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DaG: "The knees bees"

That's the funniest thing I've heard in a good while. :hysterics: :hysterics:
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7seven7
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DaGunners
Jan 27 2009, 10:08 PM
7seven7
Jan 27 2009, 03:12 PM
PaulPinpointScholes
Jan 27 2009, 06:47 PM
Quote:
 
He is a little improvement on what we have, although Flamini is better.

Now Veloso, he would be fantastic and is an IMPROVEMENT of Flamini.


O'dear DaG :hysterics: :hysterics: :hysterics:

The problem is that what you say is not a change in opinion, it is a complete contradiction that negates the value of whatever you might say. This is because if 4 months ago you thought that Veloso was an improvement on Flamini and fantastic then how can you possibly say that he's gone backwards in the last 2 years? Basically, whatever you say must therefore be taken on a day to day basis, and football doesn't happen on a day to day basis, it happens over weeks, months and years.

Also, yes, you have no DM's, but you ignore my point about Viera, Petit Gilberto, and Flamini. Namely that Wenger has only had good teams when a DM is present.

None of those players were DMs. And Denilson is a player capable of playing independent of the machine/cog idea...

Wake up, they were all DM's. None of them were attacking midfielders, none were playmakers and the strength of each player was his defensive qualities, what else were they? Because Carrick is a defensive midfielder, but he's more attacking than any of those players were. Denilson cannot play effectively in a midfield pairing with Fabregas, if this season hasn't demonstrated that then nothing will. You mention Barca as defending through the strength of their attack, but they also have Keita and Toure to play the DM role.
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DaGunners
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Danny Dyer
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They were all box to box CMs, with Vieira being the definition of box to box midfielder. The guy was an absolute tornado. Not only was he very mobile and have great defensive instincts, but he was great going forward to. The guy would win the ball high up the pitch, drive through the midfield, and play a pass that would lead to a goal. He created more goals in a prime season than the likes of Xavi/Cesc in 3 seasons. He was a walking tornado and did much more than simply sit infront of the back 4...
I am soft.
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AntMcfc
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DaGunners
Jan 28 2009, 12:32 AM
They were all box to box CMs, with Vieira being the definition of box to box midfielder. The guy was an absolute tornado. Not only was he very mobile and have great defensive instincts, but he was great going forward to. The guy would win the ball high up the pitch, drive through the midfield, and play a pass that would lead to a goal. He created more goals in a prime season than the likes of Xavi/Cesc in 3 seasons. He was a walking tornado and did much more than simply sit infront of the back 4...

:greatpost:
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Scholes
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Stop sucking up to pro-Arsenal posts Anthony.

DaG, regardless of your walking tornados, you are yet to address Seven's point. Vieira may not have been by definition a defensive midfielder, but he had great defensive attributes, and were a large part to Arsenal's success. The same applies to other aforementioned players, bar Denilson. What have you got to say to this point made by Seven?
Scholes
 

Seriously, Frank Lampard is an absolute legend of the game. He needs to be recognised in some way eg. Frank Lampard OBE, Sir Frank Lampard or some kind of lifetime achievement award.

AntMcfc
 
Greatest ownage machine: Scholes. Absolute animal when he was a regular poster, I always knew I was in the right when he was backing me up, and I couldn't wait to read a topic that he was posting in because I knew he'd be tearing someone apart
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AntMcfc
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PaulPinpointScholes
Jan 28 2009, 12:36 AM
Stop sucking up to pro-Arsenal posts Anthony.

DaG, regardless of your walking tornados, you are yet to address Seven's point. Vieira may not have been by definition a defensive midfielder, but he had great defensive attributes, and were a large part to Arsenal's success. The same applies to other aforementioned players, bar Denilson. What have you got to say to this point made by Seven?

I suck up to posts that perfectly describe one of the best CM's to ever play the game...You know how highly I rate Vieira, and thought I'd show my appreciation of a post that did Vieira justice.

:cheers:
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DaGunners
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Danny Dyer
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PaulPinpointScholes
Jan 27 2009, 06:36 PM
Stop sucking up to pro-Arsenal posts Anthony.

DaG, regardless of your walking tornados, you are yet to address Seven's point. Vieira may not have been by definition a defensive midfielder, but he had great defensive attributes, and were a large part to Arsenal's success. The same applies to other aforementioned players, bar Denilson. What have you got to say to this point made by Seven?

Just because you have defensive instincts does not make a play a defensive midfielder. There is a huge difference between a box to box midfielder and a defensive midfielder.

And Denilson has good defensive instincts and is improving all the time in that aspect and will be a very good box to box CM for Arsenal in the near future once Wenger takes the shackles off.

I had better start paying attention in class. See yall tomorrow you struggling grunts :lol:
I am soft.
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Scholes
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AntMcfc
Jan 28 2009, 12:39 AM
PaulPinpointScholes
Jan 28 2009, 12:36 AM
Stop sucking up to pro-Arsenal posts Anthony.

DaG, regardless of your walking tornados, you are yet to address Seven's point. Vieira may not have been by definition a defensive midfielder, but he had great defensive attributes, and were a large part to Arsenal's success. The same applies to other aforementioned players, bar Denilson. What have you got to say to this point made by Seven?

I suck up to posts that perfectly describe one of the best CM's to ever play the game...You know how highly I rate Vieira, and thought I'd show my appreciation of a post that did Vieira justice.

:cheers:

It would have been a respectable post if he stopped calling him a walking tornado. What's all that about?
Scholes
 

Seriously, Frank Lampard is an absolute legend of the game. He needs to be recognised in some way eg. Frank Lampard OBE, Sir Frank Lampard or some kind of lifetime achievement award.

AntMcfc
 
Greatest ownage machine: Scholes. Absolute animal when he was a regular poster, I always knew I was in the right when he was backing me up, and I couldn't wait to read a topic that he was posting in because I knew he'd be tearing someone apart
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Homer
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Denilson is nothing more than a good player....
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ManYou
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Denilson doesn't have the strength, physique or presence to dominate the midfield. Cesc has better things to be doing than trying to win over the midfield battle. So......Arsenal need to get rid of Denilson and replace him with someone who has the above attributes in abundance so that he can dominate more and then Cesc will be more effective.

Everybody here is defining DM as that Makelele role where he sits and does nothing other than clean up in his little area. But really at the end of the day it's a defensive midfielder, i.e. a midfielder who has defensive attributes and if a so called "DM" can't play in CM then he's not very good then is he?

Arsenal need a player who has the attributes Denilson clearly doesn't have. End of.
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DaGunners
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Danny Dyer
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Denilson is very mobile and is getting stronger physically game by game. Cesc performed much better defensively last season for some reason. I think he was sulking this season because his mates have left, but Denilson will have earned his and Wenger's trust and we will see a much better performance for it...
I am soft.
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Homer
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Rather have M.Diarra
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AntMcfc
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Homer
Jan 28 2009, 01:45 AM
Rather have M.Diarra

If he wasn't crocked he'd be ideal for Arsenal, not sure if I'd have him over Veloso though. Here's where Dag comes in and says ''M.Diarra is poor''
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DaGunners
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Danny Dyer
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M Diarra is fucking shit. Probably the worst passer I have ever seen...
I am soft.
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